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Let's Just Make Mitch McConnell President And Be Done With It

by: SmallTownGuy

Thu Dec 11, 2008 at 18:00:32 PM EST


Right after the election I wrote a post suggesting an end to Senate Rule XXII, the filibuster. It garnered a few comments, most thoughtful and skeptical, some dotty-such as asserting that the filibuster is not un-democratic. We now need to take another look. The filibuster has to go or Obama's program is DOA.

Let's begin with the Times headline, "Auto Bailout Appears Halted in Senate as G.O.P. Resists. Lead sentence: "The Senate Republican leader, Mitch McConnell, spoke out against the bill, effectively dooming its chances." The House passed  the auto bailout bill 237-170 after Barney Frank and Nancy Pelosi gave in to a depressing number of White House demands. Now, McConnell opposes the bill and it's clear that the Senate Dems can't muster 60 votes, so the bill is dead. Does Barney Frank enjoy being sucker-punched by John Boehner and Mitch McConnell? He sure keeps coming back for more.

Whether you were for or against the auto industry bailout, the real meaning of the way the Republicans killed the plan is that they can and will do this to every single one of Obama's flagship proposals. Every one.

Despite the self-satisfied cliché that the Republicans can win, but they can't govern, the GOP appears to have a solid game plan. It hinges on Rule XXII. But the Democrats have no sure solution to their immense problems of getting major changes passed. The political reality is that, even if Franken prevails in Missouri and Lieberman untypically behaves himself, the Senate Democrats do not have the votes to win on key issues that will be filibustered. Using Occam's razor , the solution is clear: kill the goddamn filibuster. It only takes a majority vote.  

SmallTownGuy :: Let's Just Make Mitch McConnell President And Be Done With It
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Right after the election you wrote a post to end the filibuster? (0.00 / 0)
Typical.

i was for it before the election (0.00 / 0)
I'm glad the national Republicans are being so blatant about being obstructionists, because I was getting a lot of heat for favoring the 'nuclear option' a month or two ago... and now it's becoming more and more popular. Just wait till they fake-filibuster health care!

(I say fake filibuster because the democrats never actually make Republicans filibuster; I will hand one thing to your party, they'd actually have the cajones to make us filibuster and they'd go nuclear if we did it more than once or twice.)

---
My thoughts are mine and mine alone. They should not be considered representative of any other organization, group or person - save me.

~Ryan.


[ Parent ]
Franken in Missouri?? (0.00 / 0)
Would you ever consider that there is often a  good reason for the minority party having some power? Take the banking bailout... there was tremendous pressure to ram through this bill. $700 BILLION dollars and it was just jammed down our throats. After it passed there was far more discussion about "should we have done it...", "it was a mistake.." and as I recall there was no shortage of criticism from BMG at how big of a mistake this bill was (no oversight...).

Now we have a bailout bill for Detroit which the American public is overwhelmingly against. The Republicans (and many Democrats) have voiced a lot of concern about this band-aid not fixing anything and only prolonging the inevitable, unless true changes are made. They voted it down for good reason and thankfully they had a filibuster threat to end the vote. Without it we would have had another ill conceived waste of BILLIONs of dollars which our voices have shown "We don't want".

Why, pray tell, is this wrong?

Baker/Tisei in 2010... Charlie Baker on why people "have been" leaving MA, "It's not the weather here, it's the climate"


Poll? (0.00 / 0)
"Now we have a bailout bill for Detroit which the American public is overwhelmingly against."

Anyone got a current poll?  

"It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that things are difficult." - Seneca (5 BC - 65 AD)


[ Parent ]
Google is our friend :) (6.00 / 2)
In reverse chronological order:

MSNBC (12/9):

Americans are split on the federal government giving federal aid to prevent the U.S. auto industry from failing and going bankrupt, according to a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll.

In the survey, 46 percent say they approve of the financial aid, versus 42 percent who say they oppose it.

CBS (12/8):

Forty-five percent of those surveyed approve of government assistance for Ford, General Motors and Chrysler, while nearly as many - 44 percent - disapprove.

CNN (12/3):

Sixty-one percent of those questioned in a CNN/Opinion Research Corp. survey out Wednesday are dead set against the federal government providing billions of dollars in assistance for the automakers, with 36 percent favoring such a bailout.



[ Parent ]
Thanks. (0.00 / 0)


"It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that things are difficult." - Seneca (5 BC - 65 AD)

[ Parent ]
A lot of this has to do with how the question is worded (0.00 / 0)
Using the word "bailout" causes a drop of about 20 or 30 points. (As opposed to "financial assistance" or "emergency loans")  This was true of the financial "rescue" as well.  When people were asked, "Do you support a $700 Billion Wall Street bailout?", they overwhelmingly said no, but when asked something more along the lines of "The government is considering investing as much as $700 billion in financial companies to prevent their collapse.  Would you support such an action?", the response was much more positive.


[ Parent ]
I like the new "warm and fuzzy" poll questions? (0.00 / 0)
Can we make that the standard? I'm sure the results of many of the polls asked about Republicans (like GW) might be different if we put the "warm and fuzzy" bias into the question.

Bailout is the right word and should be used. How about "Do you support increasing the budget deficit to $1-2 Trillion so we can continue to pay UAW benefits?" Should the US taxpayers (the ~50% who actually pay taxes) burden their grandchildren and support GM (corporate jet and all) so they can build more Hummers?

I guess the way you ask the question does make a big difference.

Baker/Tisei in 2010... Charlie Baker on why people "have been" leaving MA, "It's not the weather here, it's the climate"


[ Parent ]
There is absolutely... (6.00 / 1)
... a difference between a giveaway and a loan.  Nobody is served by hiding this fact.

"It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that things are difficult." - Seneca (5 BC - 65 AD)

[ Parent ]
There is absolutely... (0.00 / 0)
... a difference between a giveaway and a loan.  Nobody is served by hiding this fact.

"It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that things are difficult." - Seneca (5 BC - 65 AD)

[ Parent ]
I agree with both of you... (0.00 / 0)
Why isn't Congress calling it a loan? What assurances do we have that they will pay it back (the loan)?

Baker/Tisei in 2010... Charlie Baker on why people "have been" leaving MA, "It's not the weather here, it's the climate"

[ Parent ]
Question is, "do the results of the poll matter to you? (0.00 / 0)
Would your support change if the American public was one way or the other? If not, then who cares what the polls say?

Baker/Tisei in 2010... Charlie Baker on why people "have been" leaving MA, "It's not the weather here, it's the climate"

[ Parent ]
Your the one that... (6.00 / 1)
... brought up the American people's collective opinion.  First it matters and now it doesn't.  Could you please add a little coherence to your rants?

"It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that things are difficult." - Seneca (5 BC - 65 AD)

[ Parent ]
I'm trying, but it isn't easy for me. (0.00 / 0)
I do believe the American people's opinion does matter. My question was do YOU think it matters. If most Americans are against it, do you think it should have been defeated and if the majority were for it do you think it should have passed? The tone I was getting from Jasiu was that the opinion of the American public was changing towards supporting this bill and my belief is people who are for passing the bailout will not care what the majority of Americans think.

So in summary, yes I do think the feelings of Americans (who will have to pa for mess) certainly do matter. Thanks for asking for the clarification. Now... do YOU think how Americans feel should matter for the vote?

Baker/Tisei in 2010... Charlie Baker on why people "have been" leaving MA, "It's not the weather here, it's the climate"


[ Parent ]
It matters to me in... (0.00 / 0)
... that it is a proxy measurement for the political price people may pay for voting one way or another.  As for my own personal feeling, I'm not sure which is the most pragmatic and beneficial stance (loans, bailouts, no action, etc.).  I just want the outcome to be good.  If that means that legislatures need to go with the polls, so be it.  If that means that legislators need to go against the polls, so be it.  I won't know which is better until after the fact, unfortunately.

"It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that things are difficult." - Seneca (5 BC - 65 AD)

[ Parent ]
Thanks for being honest and not snarky. (0.00 / 0)
I agree with you that whichever plan works should be the one we go with. I would prefer not giving/loaning this money to the automakers since I feel they will never pay it back (happens a lot with government handouts). They usually come up with some jobs program in lieu of payments...

I also believe in following the will of he American people since I believe that is what our country is all about. Now obviously we don't have to have a vote on every single issue that crosses the floor of the Senate but the big votes should certainly be in line with the people's desires.

Baker/Tisei in 2010... Charlie Baker on why people "have been" leaving MA, "It's not the weather here, it's the climate"


[ Parent ]
then of course you support the government loaning money, then, right? (0.00 / 0)
yes I do think the feelings of Americans... certainly do matter.

Otherwise you're lying.  

---
My thoughts are mine and mine alone. They should not be considered representative of any other organization, group or person - save me.

~Ryan.


[ Parent ]
they have plenty of power (0.00 / 0)
the democrats are a bunch of cats; there's plenty of room for conservatives to influence government. They just shouldn't be able to stop it, especially with a mere 35 votes as they did the other day. The bottom line is the American people put democrats in charge by overwhelming numbers; that doesn't translate into a government that runs at the beck and call of the Republican party. If you think so, you do not support democracy.  

---
My thoughts are mine and mine alone. They should not be considered representative of any other organization, group or person - save me.

~Ryan.


[ Parent ]
with ya (0.00 / 0)
the filibuster is undemocratic, unnecessary and something that rarely 'protects' but frequently stifles. Bottom line: the founding fathers never used nor intended to use the filibuster; it wasn't until much later that the maneuver became commonplace. Heck, I'd settle for the Democrats actually making Republicans bust out the dictionary and encyclopedia while preventing Americans from getting jobs or health care.

Step one to any solution in the Senate is new leadership. Harry Reid has GOT to go.  

---
My thoughts are mine and mine alone. They should not be considered representative of any other organization, group or person - save me.

~Ryan.





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