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Kucinich will vote "yes" on health care; blogger conducts hilarious thought experiment

by: David

Wed Mar 17, 2010 at 18:59:36 PM EDT


Word on the street is that Dennis Kucinich, who voted "no" on the House health care bill because it didn't go far enough, has agreed after a full-court press by the president to vote "yes" on the Senate bill (which doesn't go as far as the House bill did).

Dennis Kucinich just made it official: He's voting for the Senate bill, making him the first member to go on record fliping his vote from No to Yes.... Kucinich's stance was being closely watched by both sides, partly as a test of President Obama's ability to corral the support of reluctant Dems. Obama wooed him directly with a lift on Air Force One and gave a big health care speech in his district earlier this week....

Kucinich said Obama didn't make any promises to take up the public option later.

"What he committed to was to continue to work with me on the broad concerns that I have," he said. "He didn't make any specific commitment."

I don't necessarily think Kucinich is doing the wrong thing.  But it's really a shame that he didn't get any kind of commitment for, well, anything in exchange for flipping his vote.  Which, by the way, is going to to cost him a ton of cash, since he will return all the money that people who wanted the public option raised for him.

Now, here's the excellent thought experiment conducted by blogger Adam Green at Open Left:

Air Force One took off from suburban Maryland today at 11:13 a.m. and landed 48 minutes later in Connecticut.

For Sen. Joe Lieberman -- who says he plans to vote no on the president's health-care bill -- it must have felt like a much longer flight. Obama invited Lieberman to the ultimate pressure cooker as he tries to nail down a majority for his top domestic priority.

...there was a public hint of the kind of pressure he is under. When Obama introduced Lieberman at his rally, someone in the audience called out, "Vote yes."  Obama, not missing a beat, turned to his traveling partner. "Did you hear that, Joe?" he asked.

Near the end of his speech, Obama said he had told Lieberman on the flight: "You know what? It's been such a long time since we made government on the side of ordinary working folks, where we did something for them that relieved some of their struggles."  

This is the presidential bully pulpit at work. Using the full force of the presidency to pressure opponents. Awesome!

UPDATE: Sorry for the typos. Turns out all references to Joe Lieberman were actually Dennis Kucinich.

We'll never know if the full-court press on Joe Lieberman would have had any effect on Lieberman's position that might have moved the bill in a more constructive direction.  We'll never know, because no one ever tried.  Funny, that.

David :: Kucinich will vote "yes" on health care; blogger conducts hilarious thought experiment
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that's what pisses me off (5.50 / 2)
progressives were crying out for months for the President to do something with all the weak-kneed conservadems. Obama didn't have a town hall because of Lincoln in Lincoln's state. He didn't publicly get Lincoln on Air Force One to talk about why she needed to support the original Senate bill, which had a public option.

But he was certainly willing to do it to Kucinich. Don't get me wrong, I think Kucinich made the right decision (even if I'm very bitter over how this has all turned out), but certainly Obama has continued to prove that he's willing to whip progressive democrats, while he lets conservative and corporate dems to run rough shed over all of government, doing whatever the frack they want to screw over our party and our so-called priorities.

His lack of actions, when it could have made a difference for a better bill, are not only why the bill became so bad, but also why the process has dragged out so long. If any strong, progressive democrat opposes him in the primary, I'm 99.9% sure I'll be supporting that person, because Obama's left a seriously sour taste in my mouth.  

---
My thoughts are mine and mine alone. They should not be considered representative of any other organization, group or person - save me.

~Ryan.


Plus... (0.00 / 0)
...why did the single-payer advocates tug just as hard as the blue dogs did in the opposite direction?  There are 80+ sponsors of HR 676 - where were they?

[ Parent ]
Kucinich is clearly doing the right, and rational, thing. (6.00 / 1)
As Scott Lemieux points out, voting yes on this bill doesn't constitute Kucinich compromising his principles, assuming his principles are remotely rational.  Voting against the first House bill in hopes of getting something better may have been a long shot but it wasn't necessarily pure foolhardiness.  However, it's clear now that this bill is the best we can get this time, that as bad as it is it's still better than nothing, and that we're not going to get another chance anytime soon.

When it comes down to "retain the current, bad status quo" or "make a substantial improvement in people's lives that isn't as big as you hoped," there's only one choice.

Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
That wants it down.


Bait and switch again? (6.00 / 1)
What started off as a bill to make things right for the people seems to end up feeding the health care corporations.  Even Michael Moore seems disgusted.  Pee on my leg and tell me it's raining...

"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it, and then misapplying the wrong remedies."    --Groucho Marx  


Also voting yes (0.00 / 0)
Per Rachel Maddow at least some of Stupak's allies have now said they will vote for the bill and that the Senate language really is adequate to address their concerns.  Also representatives of several orders of Catholic nuns have said that this should be passed.  The abortion language is fine with them and that to pass this bill is the truly prolife position.

Catholics (6.00 / 2)
The Catholic hospitals and Catholic nuns breaking with the bishops was without question a key development. These Reps. now have the political cover to vote for the bill. If someone attacks them for being insufficiently anti-abortion, they can turn around and say: "hey, I stood with the nuns on this issue. They know and I know that this bill doesn't give a cent for taxpayer abortions."

Without those two groups supporting the bill, I'm not sure if the Stupak group would ever switch their position.


[ Parent ]
Go nuns ! (5.00 / 1)
If you ran the RCC, maybe it would still be an institution I could be a part of.  

"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody." -Longfellow

[ Parent ]
Except for that one nun (0.00 / 0)
with the ruler.  You know, the one with the metal edge on one side to help draw straight lines.  She had a quick draw and some serious wrist action.

One more reason for me to adore my great aunt, Sister Christine Cunningham.  For supporting the health care vote, not because she keeps her ruler in a holster for fast access.


[ Parent ]
Health care (5.50 / 2)
But it's really a shame that he didn't get any kind of commitment for, well, anything in exchange for flipping his vote.

Of course, he did "get something" for the vote if he was convinced that passing this bill was a better step towards single-payer than siding with the Republicans and blowing it up.

Agreed about the Lieberman point, though -- Obama should have done more to try and sway him directly. A couple key points about Lieberman, however, which damages Adam Green's analogy:

(1) Lieberman endorsed Obama's opponent. While Kucinich initially "opposed" Obama by running in the 2008 Dem primary, he eventually endorsed him. So it's reasonable to think that Kucinich was an easier persuadable than Joe.

(2) Whether one believes it or not, Obama is on record as saying that he would like single-payer if it was possible. Since he and Kucinich agree on this point, they are possibly starting from a greater zone of agreement than are Obama/Lieberman. Not that Obama shouldn't have tried, but it does seem easier to persuade someone who opposed the bill from the left to support it than it is someone who opposed it from the right.

(3) Kucinich may be a bit off the deep end sometimes, but Joe Lieberman is little more than a backstabbing SOB. That makes it considerably harder to negotiate.


Also (0.00 / 0)
At this stage in the process, Kucinich is arguably more important than Lieberman. Insofar as the Senate seems not to be in play but the House is.

Still reasonable to wonder why Obama did not bring this kind of pressure to bear on the conservadems last summer and fall.


[ Parent ]
In all of my days (0.00 / 0)
I would never have believed this would happen.  Forced to vote for a really bad bill because voting against it would be even worse.  I am really tired of walking around in despair because of what is going on.  I was in despair during at least the last six years of the Bush administration.  I thought in 2008 that finally the bullsh*t would stop.  It hasn't.  

"Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration."
-President Lincoln


Oh please, umpteen thousand years of human history, (5.00 / 2)
Bullsh*t is one of the few constants.

Obama wasn't the Second Coming.  I'm sorry to break it to you.  But thanks to a tough slog and some even tougher compromises, health insurance for 30 million people who don't have it today is achievable, as is ending many of the worst insurance abuses.  It's not a really bad bill, it's a bill that achieves a bunch, just not all, of the goals of healthcare reform.  

If the Dems can get it done, it's a huge win.  I say, go team.  Bring it home.

"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody." -Longfellow


[ Parent ]
Relative to what we could have (6.00 / 1)
yes, it's a really bad bill.  

You are breaking this news to me?  Geez, all I can do is shake my head.  You think I thought that Barack Obama was the second coming? Don't think so, I was a Hillary Clinton supporter. I will not be supporting Barack Obama in 2012. Not unless he does some really impressive things in the near future.

This HCR bill is not a huge win.  It's a devastating blow.  I'm afraid your sugar coating is cracked.



"Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration."
-President Lincoln


[ Parent ]
"Relative to what we could have had" is just your fantasy (0.00 / 0)
This bill is what the votes existed in Congress to bring to this point.

And I'm glad you admitted yourself what a ridiculous pose it is for you claim to find a Obama a big disappointment.

"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody." -Longfellow


[ Parent ]
"Relative to what we could have had" is just your fantasy (0.00 / 0)
This bill is what the votes existed in Congress to bring to this point.

And I'm glad you admitted yourself what a ridiculous pose it is for you claim to find a Obama a big disappointment.

"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody." -Longfellow


[ Parent ]
You're right (0.00 / 0)
It was a fantasy. Obviously.

I'm awake now. I get it.

Too bad you don't.

"Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration."
-President Lincoln


[ Parent ]
And no (6.00 / 2)
I don't care how long bullsh*t has been a constant. I don't ever have to accept it as the way it has to be.

"Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration."
-President Lincoln


[ Parent ]





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