Restore Gutted Anti-Bullying Bill : Contact your State Rep

Even worse than the Senate bill (6.00 / 1)

PFLAG, GLSEN and the FEC issued a statement against the Senate bill, which failed to include enumeration and which research shows, as a result, will make no difference for glbt kids.  It looks like a further fail in the house.  Why is this so hard?  Are there legislators that think that kids should be bullied in school?

"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody." -Longfellow

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by: Bean in the 'Burbs @ Wed Mar 17, 2010 at 20:34:30 PM CDT

What is the Bill # in the House so I can look it up? (0.00 / 0)

Seriously - I would like to compare the two myself.

Deborah Sirotkin Butler
AmberPaw dot @aol.com

"Failure to plan is planning to fail."
Proverb

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by: AmberPaw @ Wed Mar 17, 2010 at 21:50:14 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Thank god they gutted it. (2.40 / 5)

Support for the bullying bill can only come from people who don't have kids in public school. That's the only way you can be so clueless.

The legislature is considering cuts which would cause my town to lay off tens of teachers. We have cut back on elective classes last year, library funding, all extra curricular. The schools scrimp on paper and books. Many schools have more than 30 students per class. Sometimes over 40.

Restoring these things is the priority.

The last thing we need is another do gooder unfunded mandate. Thank god we are not going to burn money on a bunch of psychologists wasting teacher's time training them on some politically motivated 'bullying' baloney.

Teachers should be teaching english, math, and science. Not turned into some PC police for a bunch of social activists who don't have kids in the school.

I'm writing my legislator all right. Hopefully there is time to kill the bill.

Massachusetts Election 2010
We dig up the dirt so you don't have to.

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by: Massachusetts Election 2010 @ Wed Mar 17, 2010 at 22:46:42 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Not how it works (6.00 / 2)

It's easier to teach subjects (even those not part of the English/math/science holy trinity) if your students aren't occluded by the fears of a hostile environment.  Kids learn better in a safe environment.

This bill only requires public districts to do what most of them do already, which is good for learning.

~~~~
Believe it or not, I have even more to say...

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by: sabutai @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 06:18:56 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

and kids can't learn when they're terrorized.... (0.00 / 0)

Our family suffered through a bullying episode last year, so this issue is near and dear, but I do worry about whether the bill will achieve its goals.

One thing I don't see anyone acknowledge is that it's not always clear to school staff who is the bully and who is the victim. This was an issue in our experience. So I worry that some kids would be doubly victimized, by the bullying and then punishment, even criminal charges (though it doesn't seem that's where this bill is going).

From what I've read, bullies can be kids who are "popular" with their peers AND adults. They can be kids who know how to get in the killing insults ("retard," "loser," "fatso," etc.) under the radar. Then the victim--who might have attracted the bullying because they're a little different in some way, maybe with a tendency to be highly reactive--responds in a way that draws negative attention from the adults, and the whole thing escalates in a really awful way.  

I think there's a real need for good training of staff on how to handle these things. Sometimes the bully needs support and intervention too, not always punishment. I think that's part of some successful anti-bullying programs.

From the way our situation was handled, I have a real concern that the requirements of this bill will make administrators, especially if they feel unable to deal with these things, want to hide the problem, not report and deal with it.  

"It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education." --  Einstein

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by: LisaG @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 07:39:56 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

There was a thread about this legislation (6.00 / 2)

a few months ago that explored the pros and cons as well as the efficacy of actual legislation.  There is legitimate debate among educators regarding the concerns you raise.  This is a difficult topic for people to talk about as it tends to get quite personal and emotional.  The research at Bridgewater State College's MARC is valuable and current.  They've done stuff at our school, and it was worthwhile.

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by: lightiris @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 09:10:22 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

CLUEx4 (0.00 / 0)

Support for the bullying bill can only come from people who don't have kids in public school. That's the only way you can be so clueless.

Tanks.  I was wondering what that itchy sensation was... turns out to be cluelessness!   I was so worried that actual harm could come from intimidation, violence and other criminal behaviour... turns out, I just don't know what I'm talking about.

I am, sir, in your debt.

The legislature is considering cuts which would cause my town to lay off tens of teachers. We have cut back on elective classes last year, library funding, all extra curricular. The schools scrimp on paper and books. Many schools have more than 30 students per class. Sometimes over 40.

Restoring these things is the priority.

I yield to no one here in my strenuous support of education funding.  Which is why I find your 'priorities' fascinating:  I would very much like to place 'safety' and 'security' (both physical and emotional) atop that list of priorities.

You, and others, posit a view that bullying is to real crime like playing with matches is to arson: a petty thing, altogether accidental in its harm and, in itself, somehow excusable.  This view is wrong: removed from the context of education, the acts that comprise 'bullying' are crimes.  Why, then, is bullying not considered a crime?

The last thing we need is another do gooder unfunded mandate. Thank god we are not going to burn money on a bunch of psychologists wasting teacher's time training them on some politically motivated 'bullying' baloney.

Bologna aside, the several acts and intents we've associated under the rubric of 'bullying' are, separately and distinctly, considered criminal acts.   In every other situation, threats of violence, intimidation, harrassment and/or coercion are crimes.  It's only under the nominal aegis of in loco parentis, perhaps providing a governing limit, and the respective ages of the 'bully' and the bullied, that such crimes are, in effect if not affect, mitigated.  

Consider: if a random stranger, having achieved his/her majority, walked unto school grounds and started harassing students using exactly the same techniques as some feckless peer already on school grounds, what would/should happen to him/her?  

It's ok. You can say it.  Everybody knows what the answer is....

I'm not, per se, in favor of a blanket criminalization of bullying, only because the bullies are, themselves, oft troubled and floundering.  So I favor clear identification, intervention and counseling for both the bully and the bullied.  

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"Providing health care to the uninsured is a job killer, while not providing health care is merely a people killer....   Bonus: Job Openings!!"

--Stephen Colbert

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by: petr @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 07:37:21 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Bullying when it rises to the level of crime.... (0.00 / 0)

is already a crime. An assault is already illegal anywhere it happens - in school or out of school.

If our schools were already fully funded I would consider a sensible requirement for a bullying policy or  even some training. But given the fact that teachers for the basics are already on the chopping block - spending money on 'bullying' seems irresponsible.

Massachusetts Election 2010
We dig up the dirt so you don't have to.

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by: Massachusetts Election 2010 @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 08:51:17 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Is there a 'how come' on this? Were these requirements deemed unfunded mandates? (0.00 / 0)

Yr. Obedient Servant, Peter Porcupine, Republican

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by: Peter Porcupine @ Wed Mar 17, 2010 at 22:39:06 PM CDT

Rep. Charley Murphy was approached by reporters i've heard (0.00 / 0)

And shown on the 11 o'clock news refusing to answer questions about his motives.  I'd certainly prefer to think that financial concerns were in his mind, not a desire to give bullies a free pass.  But safety for kids in school needs to come first, not last on the priority last; kids that are being abused and targeted are not being the afforded the opportunity to learn they should be.   Anti-bullying programs aren't a "frill".

"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody." -Longfellow

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by: Bean in the 'Burbs @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 05:13:35 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Although, on second look, ascribing a fiscal motive seems too kind (0.00 / 0)

The only one of the gutted provisions that would cost anything is teacher training.  Maybe Rep. Murphy just was a bully and doesn't want to interfere with the continuation of that school culture.

"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody." -Longfellow

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by: Bean in the 'Burbs @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 05:40:47 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

We may not have marriage equality in WA, but (0.00 / 0)

the WA legislature just passed their 2nd anti-bullying law, and the vote was UNANIMOUS.  c'mon, massachusetts, yer slackin!

Click HERE and sign up: Campaign For Military Partners.

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by: Laurel @ Wed Mar 17, 2010 at 23:15:34 PM CDT

Stories in the Globe, Herald, and Bay Windows (0.00 / 0)

Here's the Globe story: http://www.boston.com/news/edu...

Here's the Herald story: http://www.bostonherald.com/ne...

Here's the Bay Windows story:
http://www.baywindows.com/inde...

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by: tudor586 @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 06:37:06 AM CDT

Arrest That Kid Officer!!!! (3.00 / 2)

Fourth grade Johnny pushing Fifth Grade Billy is a crime you know. Kids commit crimes all day long. At home, at school, everywhere. Taking a pen from another kids desk is stealing. That's a crime. A sister hitting her brother. So now parents have to send their kids to school worrying about them getting arrested for being kids.

Meanwhile, Mrs. Smith is being robbed and beaten by an addict but the cops are busy in Miss Crabtree's class.

Why is this? So you can track kids? So we can hire more public employees? (The bully liason etc.)

The Bullying Bill is outrageous.

You liberals scare the goddamn hell out of me. You want to start labeling people early on then track them.

What about words? Hurtful words? I am sure we will find a crime for that.

Charles Rudnick for State Senate

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by: EB3 fka Ernie Boch III @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 08:33:17 AM CDT

Red Herring (6.00 / 2)

Except there is nothing in either the House or Senate bill that requires reporting bullying to the police.  The only time police would be involved is if an act of bullying became an assault or other such offense, and in that case, a report would be made with or without the bullying bill.

So you argument is pointless and not at all grounded in fact.  You non-liberals scare the hell out of me, arguing about fiction rather than focusing on fact.

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by: wahoowa @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 09:29:02 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Pushing a Kid is an Assault (0.00 / 0)

The only time police would be involved is if an act of bullying became an assault

hmmm, when did the state, federal and common laws change? I missed that?

You non-liberals scare the hell out of me, arguing about fiction rather than focusing on fact.

Sorry wahoowa, I misunderstand the facts. I thought hitting someone was assault and battery.

My mistake. Can you be a dear and link to some info on these historical changes in the law?

Charles Rudnick for State Senate

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by: EB3 fka Ernie Boch III @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 09:40:56 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Nothing in this bill... (0.00 / 0)

...changes the way schools interact with the police.  There is no requirement here that any reported incident of bullying in turn be reported to the police.  If a kid is pushed and that's an assault, that can be reported to the police now, without the bill.  

So yeah, you did misunderstand if you are positing that passage of this bill will lead to the police being at schools all the time.  Nothing would change vis a vis the schools and the police.  There is no criminal component to the bill at all.

Instead of focusing on irrelevancy, why don't we debate the merits of the actual bill and what it actually does and does not do.  It doesn't change criminal law.  It doesn't "track" kids.  What the bill does (the Senate version at least) is try to educate kids, teachers and other school employees about bullying so that more senseless deaths, like those of Carl Walker-Hoover and Phoebe Prince, can be avoided.

Will this, or any legislation, end all bullying?  Clearly not.  But that doesn't mean we should sit idly by and watch these incidents continue to happen.  This bill (the Senate version at least) gives schools the tools to start addressing this problem.

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by: wahoowa @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 10:08:23 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Wrong Again wahoowa (0.00 / 0)

If you read the body of this post you would have seen that one of the things eliminated by the House but still wanted by advocates is

the requirement that principals notify law enforcement if they believe a crime is implicated

Stop embarressing yourself wahoowa. Or is this just a smoke screen to hide the fact that some advocates want the police to be called upon an assualt. That's what it says above?

What do youy want wahoo. What precisely is your position?

Charles Rudnick for State Senate

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by: EB3 fka Ernie Boch III @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 10:27:57 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

What I want... (0.00 / 0)

...is for kids to be able to go to school without the fear of being terrorized by their peers.  What I want is for kids to not be teased so cruelly and mercilessly that they feel their only option is to end their life.

Is the language any different that what a principal currently has as a responsibility?  If a crime is committed at school, doesn't the principal have a responsibility/requirement to report that to the police, with or without the bill?

Oh, and EB3, I'm still waiting for a link to the language that will "label and track" individual students.    

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by: wahoowa @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 10:57:58 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

You tell Me (0.00 / 0)

Hitting is a crime. It's called assault and battery. Do principals call the police now when one kid hits another?


Charles Rudnick for State Senate

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by: EB3 fka Ernie Boch III @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 12:12:02 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

A&B (0.00 / 0)

If one adult hits another, even when the police are made aware of it by a third party, it does not always catch their interest. If no one makes a complaint, the police will take no action, and will usually not even investigate. You don't actually believe that every smack in the face results in a police report, do you?

Shoe bomber, underwear bomber -- why aren't we waging war on clothes?

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by: kirth @ Fri Mar 19, 2010 at 08:01:43 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

They didn't "gut it" totally (0.00 / 0)

I know the media likes to jump all over things, but all the committee did was make it so that the Department of Education has to write rules and regulations about identification and reporting of bullying.  They hardly ignored it... they're directing DOE to do the same thing that the Senate did.

DOE is supposed to be the professionals... they are in a much better place to say how to administer this law in a school.

The Senate bill didn't require mandatory training for teachers either. Both versions say that they "may" be trained.

The bill does a lot of good things.

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by: TrueBlueLou2 @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 09:58:29 AM CDT

This is a silly bill (0.00 / 0)

turning bullying into a crime is silly. Kids have been bullying other kids forever. This is seriously why people don't like liberals. And I am a liberal!

Matt Wilding
We Talk The Talk

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by: mattmedia @ Thu Mar 18, 2010 at 15:44:30 PM CDT